Storytelling or Mechanics?

[Tumblecheck]

I know D&D isn't a perfect system, but saying it's like a video game is an over simplification, in any of it's editions.  There are far more options to the player and the DM can restructure a campaign to fit the group on a whim.  A player can have far different experiences with a D&D campaign (even playing the same campaign more than once) as opposed to say God of War, where everyone has, roughly, the same experience. 

Even playing Balder's Gate and Icewind Dale fer the PC, I find it far more restricting with what I can do when compared to a table top game. 

[Lady Savage]

Even playing Balder's Gate and Icewind Dale fer the PC, I find it far more restricting with what I can do when compared to a table top game. 

Certainly a tabletop experience is fundamentally different from a video game experience because you have so much more freedom. But from what I've seen of 4.0, it deviates even more into a stylized cartoon/video game/board game flavor in the art style and play style--for example, the addition of "powers" for every class seems kind of silly for martial classes, since "powers" seem like they would be associated with some source of divine/arcane magic. In real life warriors don't get "powers", they use training and maneuvers (i.e. feats and skills). For some reason 4th ed seems more like WoW to me. 3.5 doesn't really qualify as realistic, I know, but compare 4th to, say, 2nd ed, it feels really out there and disconnected from reality, which ruins my immersion.

BTW I've played much more 3.5 than 4 so I am ridiculously biased.

[kabuto202]

I see it as this: A good story is extremely adaptable. So is a good system. So why not take your favorite system and your favorite story and put them togethether. That reminds me, I'm going to running Dragon Age RPG using the Warhammer FRPG rule set after I'm done with Shadorun at Weekend Anime.

@Savage: You may remember me as Urahara Kitsuke or on Sat as the guy with the sweet hat.

[nephilistic]

It's all story. The mechanics invariably has flaws so you can manipulate to a very boring but very powerful position. A good story can be the fuel that drives a Friday night game in to the small hours of Sunday. Poor mechanics can be worked around but a lame story and your game is doomed.

And JACKIE watch those 2ND ed comments, or I'll need a called shot right in your nose.

[Lady Savage]

Hey Neph, what's your THAC0?

[nephilistic]

don't have my sheet in front of me but I run around a 12 or so. That's why I like boff +1 or better.

[Kitteninstrings]

We've hatefully lovingly nicknamed 4.0 as FinalfantasyWoWTactics... ^__^

[Budfannan]

I have to agree with Neph on this one.  The story is what counts for me.  Every system has its flaws and its strengths but I personally lean towards light rules.  The light systems allow for more flexibility for me and my storytelling style.

I have found over the many years of gaming that it all falls back on trust.  So many people have used the old story of RPGing is like Cowboys and Indians but with rules.  I think that it is better to say that when you were playing C&I you all trusted each other because you were friends so you did not need set rules.  Now when we play as adults the rules create a sense of trust based on their control of the situation.  As you play more and more with people you become less dependent on the rules for that sense of trust.

This is why for me I enjoy light systems with little rules to control my storytelling but for others they like the games they have always played but they let go of many of the rules to let the story flow (or House Rule it) as their group plays together.

Ian

[Budfannan]

As for Red Box D&D, Advanced, 3rd Edition, 3.5 or 4 I think they are all very different games.  Each incarnation of D&D has seen major changes and reworkings to the point where people playing anything recent can't even recognize the really old stuff.  I think this is OK.

I think that each stands out as a good game in their own style.  I agree that it has gotten more and more mini focused but that is where it came  from (Chainmail) so now it has gone full circle.  I don't really play any of them now and can't play 4th because it is so mini focused and I have no minis but I actually like the way it plays.

For me D&D is always a lame horse game.  It takes the ideas of other games and filters them in away that doesn't have the same magic. 

Ian

PS My THAC0 is a 19.

[AgentMeister]

Jackie you just keep getting more and more awesome in my book.

Thanks for bringing Feng Shui to the table so to speak.   It's an awesome system where the dice constantly get in the way for me.  I can't roll decently in the game for crap.  Still love the world and the system though. ^_^

The dice shouldn't be getting in the way of a good story! (And I don't think I've ever seen you at my Feng Shui games. Should try it next year, you might be surprised.)
--Te

[ragabash!]

Next year I might actually have the time. 

[Sabersage]

I used to be in a group where the DM made a majority of the rolls. We had to make them if it was something rediculous and creativity was rewarded. Case in point, we some friends and i had been traveling in a dungeon (shocker) and were resting. Random encounters are always fun because they caught us disarmed. Of all things, zombies stumbled upon us. In a febel attempt to get our equipment we managed to grab a backpackpack and rope. Uh-huh, we were that good.

We managed to break off from the horde and managed to make it to a small ditch, which we all made it accross (there were 3 of us total). We had come up with the idea to confuse them by throwing iron rations at them and then tie the backpack to the rope and try pulling them into the pit. Good times. We got a lot of credit for that. Imagine the DM's surprise when he had to generate hit probabilities for iron rations and damage.

I don't like overpowered characters. I find that my style clashes with anyone who wants like tier 10 armor at level 1 Sorry, Wow flashback. I love a good, creative story that lets you use your imagination as it was intended. I like DnD 2nd addition personally, but I'm also biased because i haven't tried the other ones yet. Now that i'm older, its hard to find anyone to "geek" out with.

[Budfannan]

Where are you located Sabersage?  You can come geek out with my group.  How about Weekend Anime? 

Geeks Unite!

Ian

[Sabersage]

I'm over in steep falls. I'm about 25 minutes outside of Portland.

[Budfannan]

My group is out.  We are in Belfast about two hours outside Portland but Weekend Anime would be in your area (Westbrook).  Also Crossroad Games may be around you too.

Ian